A Conversation with Mac Barnett and Jon Klassen

Mac Barnett and Jon Klassen, a kidlit power couple more enjoyable to listen to surely than any Branjelina or Bennifers 1.0 or 2.0.

They've done SIX amazing books together and Jon jokes that they started out as friends but are no longer. Jon is teasing, of course, it's rare authors and illustrators are in touch at all during the picturebook-making process! But these two working closely together equals Caldecott Honors and Horn Book and E.B. White award stickers slapped deservedly on some of our absolutely most favorite picture books of the 21st century. Mac says their working relationship is an 'anabolized' version of the way words and art should work together in a picture book: Two simple organisms (Mac and Jon) combine to be one much stronger, better entity (like the Decepticons combining into The Devastator).

For example:

Mac reads us their book, SAM AND DAVE DIG A HOLE.

88% sure Mac and Jon would not eat this

A book idea that sprang from a lighthearted discussion over heavy breakfast foods on the design puzzle of book trim sizes.

Jon had been talking to Mac about how his I WANT MY HAT BACK series was often difficult to shelve at bookstores and libraries because the books are so wide. So for fun Jon and Mac started spitballing ideas that would lend themselves well to a very tallll book. To Mac and Jon the sky is boring, thus digging down was the answer.

And the art you brainstorm when digging down leads itself very well to being a sequential image series which is another good checkmark to check on the well-made picture book checklist.

Exercise: Try taking advantage of the form or treating something like trim size as a constraint/puzzle to solve even before you pick the plot in a picture book. 

Jon and Mac never start with theme or message, they always start with the characters or a visual joke, and how you push that joke beyond the joke into a deeper meaning is one way you can get to your picture book's message. Most funny ideas, says Jon, if you dig deeper on them have a sincere or sad internal, universal truth.

Another benefit of authors and illustrators working together directly, the ability of the art to change or inform the story. Their initial idea of Sam and Dave moving around and missing the diamonds was much, much more complicated visually and had an entire subplot only in the dirt of sparring skeletons and dinosaurs besides the bigger and bigger diamonds. Mac and Jon scrubbed that big, complicated side plot because not only did the diamonds by themselves get great laughs, just having the large diamonds as the art focus on a page meant the images were readable across a crowded room, which Mac says is an important thing to think about when making a picture book.

He mentions the three levels of connection in the world as they apply to reading picture books:

1. Only to yourself (kid reading alone)
2. One to one connection (kid being read to by a caregiver)
3. One to many (kid being read to in a large classroom setting where it's hard to see tiny picture details so some big compositions will shine)

If your book can hit all three of these levels, bonus points to you.

Questions about authors and illustrators working together:

Even if you aren't in touch, authors and illustrators should still consider themselves as equal parts of a team. Mac says authors shouldn't say "So-and-so is illustrating my book," because a picture book is NOT your book yet, it's not even a BOOK without the pictures, so you need to think of the illustrator as having an authorial seat in the picture book making process, too.

Jon Scieszka and Mac Barnett: Kids as Story Readers and Storytellers

Jon Scieszka and Mac Barnett read from BATTLE BUNNY and show pages

We were lucky enough to see the world premiere of the BATTLE BUNNY trailer during this hilarious break-out session. It's probably not true that this is the first time the trailer has played, but as we learned in Mac's keynote this morning, there is a bit of overlap between truth and lie, and there's a melon patch there, and the fruit it bears is delicious and...

Mac Barnett ties his own shoes

OK, so the trailer. It was outstanding and is likely to change the way children eat cake forever. We'll post it here once a link is available. This Battle Bunny link is DEFINITELY not their trailer, but if you like people in furry costumes, have at it, but you'll have to wash out your eyes afterward. (And definitely don't read the comments.)

Then they read BATTLE BUNNY to us. Bottom line: If this book isn't banned somewhere, there is no justice in the world.

It's hilarious and sick and so unexpected--only that's what we've all come to expect from Jon and Mac. The conceit: a sweet Golden Book style book about a bunny celebrating his very special birthday. Only someone has defaced the book and turned the birthday bunny into Battle Bunny.

It's an artistic technique that's been used for ages. Mac showed a series of slides that show how the Mona Lisa has been modified by artists over the years. He also talked about musical mashups, and how things like this are conversations between pieces of art.

Jon Scieszka wants to hypnotize you.

"This is what I've always loved to do," Jon said. A third grader explained it to him: "You just take other people's stuff and mess it up."

They showed a few sample pages from one child's handmade books. The illustrations are epically violent and the text is grim (and Cormac McCarthy-taut). There are even artifacts, like a mock front page of The New York Times, which has an ad for World War III war bonds as well as a reader's thumb on the corner of the page.

It's incredibly inspirational to see what these kids--our readers--are capable of imagining for themselves, and it shows the disconnect between what we expect them to create and write and what they do, which is similar to what we expect them to read and what they actually want them to read.

Mac put it really well: "You've gotta find that sweet spot in the middle, where, if you were sitting with a 5-year-old or a sixth grader, what would you enjoy talking to that kid about? What kind of conversation would be valuable for both of you? Because that's what a book is."

"You have to know these kids and know them well enough to be passionate about arguing for this stuff," he said.

Staying close to kids is vital, they said. Jon took drafts of THE STINKY CHEESE MAN out on the road when he was reading another picture book. He cut his stories in half after reading them to kids. "You just work your story. You get rid of all of the extra stuff."

Reading aloud is important. "It's frightening," Jon said. "But it's amazingly helpful."

Mac highlighted the three ways books are read by kids:

• a kid reading by herself
• 1:1 a parent/babysitter reading to a child
• a teacher or librarian reading to a big group of kids

Different books work for all of them, but a book doesn't have to, he said. Sendak's nutshell library is tiny. It's not meant for a teacher reading to a class. BABAR, meanwhile, is big and works in that setting. Context matters, too. Some books should be getting kids ready for bed. Other books are meant to get them fired up. 

It was a great session: smart and funny. The only downside? We have to wait till October for BATTLE BUNNY to come out. 

Mac Barnett Keynote: What You Need To Know About Making Books For People Who Are Often Shorter Than You and Sometimes Have More Trouble Tying Their Shoes

Mac Barnett giving his keynote to a packed ballroom

Mac Barnett is the author of some remarkable picture books, like Extra Yarn (which won a 2013 Caldecott Honor and the 2012 Boston Globe-Horn Book Award for Excellence in Picture Books), Oh No Not Again! and the middle grade Brixton Brothers mysteries.

Lin Oliver introduces him as "smart, quirky, funny and contemporary."

Mac starts off his keynote by reading to us from his picture book Guess Again?  He has the room laughing - and proves that he is indeed smart, quirky, funny and so of the moment -- setting up our expectations and making us laugh when we're wrong!

"Art is a lie that makes us realize the truth" - Pablo Picasso

Is a quote Mac has been thinking about a lot.  He even has a ven diagram about it, truth and lies as two circles that overlap -- and that center where they overlap is art, or what he likes to call WONDER.

He tells us about discovering that sense of wonder when he worked at a summer camp and he would tell extraordinary stories with cliffhangers to the campers -- stories that would go on for an entire week.  He's making us laugh again, and tying it all into a discussion of the suspension of disbelief.

Mac speaks about the tutoring center 826 LA (for which he's on the Board of Directors) and how the store in front, "The Echo Park Time Travel Mart" sells products across time, like robot emotion chips.  Their broken slushie machine has a sign that says "Out of Order: Come Back Yesterday."  He explains how the store is like a "book in three dimensions" and how that is linked to his creative process of writing picture books.

He's discussing meta-fiction, and tells us the incredible story of how there's a hidden offer inside his book, Billy Twitters and His Blue Whale Problem, to get your very own blue whale.  Some kids (very much kids like Mac was) actually send away for the whale, and in return they get a letter from a Norwegean law firm explaining that there's been a customs delay in delivering their whale, but offering a phone number that they can call to leave their whale a message.  Some of them call, and after some whale sounds, they hear a beep, and they leave a message!  Mac plays us the adorable phone messages that one child, Nikko, left for his very own whale, Randolph.

Not an actual photo of Randolph, who is not an actual pet of an actual child reader... but on some amazing, wondrous level, this is absolutely Nikko's pet blue whale, Randolph.  Look, Randolph is even smiling (and perhaps burping at the same time - he really enjoyed the soda Nikko sent him.)

Mac shares his wonder at how he gets to do something "weird and strange and bold and experimental ...and have kids accept it into their lives."

He challenges us to experiment ourselves because "childhood is, by nature, experimental."

It's an inspiring talk - and Mac's books in the conference bookstore are sure to sell out!

Spot Yourself! Autograph Party Photos Part 1

Right before the autograph party, Katy Betz and Lauren Gallegos show off their excellent sleuthing abilities. They found the conference CANDY STASH.

E.B. Lewis and E.B. fan/author/Southern Breeze Co-RA Jo Kittinger

Author and Western Washington Co-RA Joni Sensel waits for Loren Long to sign his lovely picture books

Cocoa & Kate author Erica Silverman, nonfiction powerhouse Melissa Stewart, and Simon Bloom author Michael Reisman

It is Mac Barnett. He always looks this happy to see someone. That's why we like him.

How to Be a Spaceheadz: a Multimedia Thingy* Starring Jon Scieszka

Here's the sad truth about Jon Scieszka: Though he is a man, he doesn't actually smell like stinky cheese (usually). But it's OK. It really is, because there's no one who gives better, smarter, or funnier advice about writing for children.**

The full title of his talk was How to Be a Spaceheadz: The Ups and Downs and Sideways of Telling a Story Across Multiple Media. (The sign outside the room omitted the final Z, but people managed to find the room anyway. Even that Mac Barnett guy.)

OK. So multimedia is a huge opportunity for us, Jon says, because no one has any idea what it really means (which you can tell from looking at at some of the early stuff out there).

This medium is not built for adapting other things, he says. If you want to work in this medium, work in this medium. What would exist well on a phone or iPad? "Don't just take Where the Wild Things Are and crap it up."

Kids today know how to use technology, but they don't really understand the difference between story and advertising. Jon's new series, SPACEHEADZ, aims to help make these kids media literate. It imagines a trio of aliens who've learned everything they know about earth from watching television. They come to earth to recruit humans.

Jon is using Facebook, MySpace, YouTube, Flickr, music playlists, and Twitter (including one account entirely in hamsterese) to build the online dimension of the story.

Jon also told us the secret to writing books that will make kids laugh. We're still working on getting the translation from hamster, but here it is: Eeek. Eeek eek eek eek; eek eek. Eek? Eeek eek. Eeek! Eeek! (Eeek eek eeek eek eeek--eek.)

* Is it just me, or is it hard to think of words after last night's party?
** When Madonna has schedule conflicts, that is. Because that lady, she is a major hoot.

It's not Mac & Cheese, it's Mac & Steve! 5 Lessons from Classic Picture Books That Can Help You Launch Your Career

There was a typo in today's conference schedule. I thought, and I believe so did the standing room only crowd, that we were in Room Constellation 1 for Free Mac & Cheese. But it turned out it was only author/raconteur/multiple-pattern-wearing Mac Barnett with his junior agent, the barely memorable Steven Malk.

Mac and Steve didn't have any food to share, but instead some practical lessons on how you can create better picture books by reading classic picture books.

Steve: There's always a place for great picture books. I sent out a book last week that was a real throw back, one editor called it 'the love child of Maurice Sendak and Sandra Boynton.' Editors still love and look to the classics in picture books... I always try to stay away from trends.

Mac: Which brings us to Lesson Number One: Vampire Picture Books.

The slide show starts, all the gorgeous hand-lettering of the rules slides (which you can't see) done by Laura Park.

Lesson #1: Let the Illustrations Do Their Job

 

A masterpiece of storytelling with no words, GOODNIGHT GORILLA 

 

 

A masterpiece of not overwriting the scene, THE STUPIDS STEP OUT

 

 

A masterpiece of leaving the whole joke to the art, THE CARROT SEED

Lesson #2: Understand the Picture Book's Conventions

The Page Turn (Mac thinks this is the most imporant aspect of plotting a picture book and here are some of his favorites)

HENRY'S AWFUL MISTAKE 

 

 

THE MONSTER AT THE END OF THIS BOOK

Page layout formats, when repeated, create a visual rhythm for a book

(As an author, Mac especially enjoys writing wordless, two-page spreads.)

Good visual rhythm and suspenseful page turns in 

 

 

MADELEINE

 

THE HAT (Mac hearts Tomi Ungerer!!!)

 

 

 BILLY TWITTERS AND HIS BLUE WHALE PROBLEM

Lesson #3 The Writing Must Serve the Book

 

Pay a lot of attention to how YOU are going to write your book, not how Dr. Seuss would have written your book. Pick a tone and stick with it—will it be sweet? Or have an edge? If you do want to rhyme, Mac recommends Paul Fussell and Mary Oliver's great books on verse.

 

Some good examples of rhyme from Steve who says there's a logic to why they used rhyme and they read flawlessly:

 

BEAR SNORES ON

 

 

TIME FOR BED

 

 

GUESS AGAIN!

Steve: Read your work out loud to lots of people. People that have never heard it before. Like when the UPS guy comes by, read your story to him.

Mac: Don't read your story to the UPS guy, that's a horrible idea, he'll start losing all your packages if you do that.

Lesson #4, Lesson #5 I will save for conference goers alone to relish. But here's a shot of Steve and Mac being mobbed after their session:

 

And here's illustrator/writer Dan Santat, illustrator of Mac's OH NO!. That is his happy face.

SCBWI TEAM BLOG Pre-conference Interview: Author Mac Barnett

Our newest SCBWI TEAM BLOG member Martha Brockenbrough has posted the first in a series of pre-conference interviews with Annual Summer Conference faculty kicking things off with delightful author Mac Barnett.

Mac will join agent Steven Malk for a conference workshop called FIVE LESSONS FROM CLASSIC PICTURE BOOKS THAT CAN HELP YOU LAUNCH YOUR CAREER.

Here is a snippet from Martha's interview with Mac. For more click here.

"Here's the first in a series of posts designed to make you want to go to the SCBWI conference in L.A., where you'll meet and mingle with lots of industry stars. One of my favorites is Mac Barnett—and not just because he knows how to rock a five o'clock shadow better than that guy from Wham..."

Click here to register for the Annual Summer Conference.